tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1638916042737526171.post8683297738459917710..comments2024-03-28T07:16:39.621+00:00Comments on Lallands Peat Worrier: Scottish Labour's Samson strategy?Lallands Peat Worrierhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/18276270498204697708noreply@blogger.comBlogger42125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1638916042737526171.post-90804492705819438492012-11-27T12:19:58.624+00:002012-11-27T12:19:58.624+00:00RevStu's post shows the quandary for the Scott...RevStu's post shows the quandary for the Scottish electorate. To decide whether an independent Scotland would be free of the corruption he cites.<br />Will the SNP question and investigate such contracts?<br />Will they make public the legal and technical advice given and by whom?<br /><br />We do know Labour is responsible.<br />We want to know - What are you going to do about it?<br />Will the SNP challenge this contract? Now.terrencehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15075471706398555654noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1638916042737526171.post-87281577986731268072012-11-26T23:30:27.013+00:002012-11-26T23:30:27.013+00:00Indy, the reason people go on about Lamont's u...Indy, the reason people go on about Lamont's use of the fabricated rape case, is because it was only partly fabricated. It actually followed extremely closely a tragic story that was hugely prominent in the early 2000s.<br /><br />That Lamont, a frequent speaker in Holyrood on the issue of violence against women, didn't recognise the similarities was astounding. Astounding ignorance or astounding political cynicism, we struggle to decide.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1638916042737526171.post-51391474278443732812012-11-26T21:12:09.365+00:002012-11-26T21:12:09.365+00:00You know what's a disgusting waste of public m...You know what's a disgusting waste of public money? <b>£579 million</b>.<br /><br />http://wingsland.podgamer.com/the-something-for-nothing-country/<br /><br />Carping about £4,000 after that is a pretty fucked sense of priorities. RevStuhttp://wingsland.podgamer.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1638916042737526171.post-78681788040248810472012-11-26T19:27:49.077+00:002012-11-26T19:27:49.077+00:00Allan
See! I knew that you had just misread your ...Allan<br /><br />See! I knew that you had just misread your notes.<br /><br />Wouldn't it be a fine world, if politicians could spend every penny on the needy, instead of spending it on other things?<br /><br />£23,387 on FOI requests might equally be considered a frivolous squandering of resources, which could have been better spent elsewhere?<br /><br />However,like "Disgusted of Tunbridge Wells", I suspect that your disgust is only selectively applied.oldnatnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1638916042737526171.post-32832200989279152702012-11-26T18:54:45.300+00:002012-11-26T18:54:45.300+00:00So, Oldnat & Stravonian, you condone the waste...So, Oldnat & Stravonian, you condone the waste of taxpayers money just so long as your argument wins out then?<br /><br />Like I said above, I find that stance disgusting at a time of economic hardship. It's equally disgusting whether it is £3,960 (or as Sturgeon put it not "an absolutely final figure") or the reported £100,000Allanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13574173214924437278noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1638916042737526171.post-13087871567726425712012-11-26T15:04:59.058+00:002012-11-26T15:04:59.058+00:00
To cut to the chase -is it a labour strategy - no...<br />To cut to the chase -is it a labour strategy - no merely an affliction.Crinkly & Ragged Arsed Philosophershttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08902364411241935656noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1638916042737526171.post-73304289678339694452012-11-26T14:06:19.550+00:002012-11-26T14:06:19.550+00:00Stravonian
No need for the "L" word!
A...Stravonian<br /><br />No need for the "L" word!<br /><br />Allan probably just misread the number from the briefing notes he was given.<br /><br />When he wants to correct the "Official Record" here, I'm sure LPW would be happy to allow him to do so.<br /><br />Of course, if Allan doesn't so wish ......oldnatnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1638916042737526171.post-22443504332925933452012-11-26T13:05:01.069+00:002012-11-26T13:05:01.069+00:00Allan
The £100,000 figure is a lie. On that fals...Allan<br /><br />The £100,000 figure is a lie. On that false foundation, your post collapses.<br /><br />"The First Minister said the true legal costs so far amounted to "just less than £4,000," out of a total legal bill estimated to be £12,000.<br /><br />"I would imagine the information commissioner's legal costs are somewhere around the same quantum, or something around that. That's incidentally a world away from the £100,000 pounds which was claimed by a Liberal [Democrat] MP in the House of Commons today - a figure which is plucked out of thin air."Stravoniannoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1638916042737526171.post-57299343208340108012012-11-25T15:57:14.104+00:002012-11-25T15:57:14.104+00:00Stravonian.
I find your assertion that the waste ...Stravonian.<br /><br />I find your assertion that the waste of £100,000 was "money well spent" to be utterly offensive in a time of austerity. It does not do your cause any good whatsoever.<br /><br />Prehaps the next time Swinney moans about the block grant, when the "Unionists" point to that waste of money you will think about the votes that the "well spent money" will have cost your cause.Allanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13574173214924437278noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1638916042737526171.post-46747176101019089292012-11-25T01:11:31.036+00:002012-11-25T01:11:31.036+00:00Very good article LPW and needed saying. FMQ each ...Very good article LPW and needed saying. FMQ each week is becoming a total farce and to think that foreign visitors are courteously welcomed into the chamber then to suffer the screeching and desk-banging by the Labour side is nothing short of deplorable. <br /><br />That's on the face of it; your main import, that it is a deliberate wrecking tactic, Luddite even, by the opposition parties and I include the Tories in this, to deflate the importance and purpose of the Scottish Parliament, has to be a serious consideration for anyone bent on perfecting self-government for Scotland.<br /><br />I would caution the FM and any Scottish Government speakers from now on, to beware the bear-pit traps and to conduct themselves properly in a manner and with the substance deserving of their position.<br /><br />As to the opposition parties - I warn them that no good will come of this behaviour. Already there are signs that the voting public have no time for wasters and any attempt to belittle this Scottish Parliament will have severe political repercussions.<br /><br />Scotland needs a strong debating chamber to take it forward and there is very little evidence of productive debate being undertaken to date. Shame on you.Barontorchttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09013396482625243468noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1638916042737526171.post-37814081117540345272012-11-24T21:41:41.783+00:002012-11-24T21:41:41.783+00:00Braveheart
I'll assume that you are too young...Braveheart<br /><br />I'll assume that you are too young to have been around at the time. The 1997 referendum was a pre-legislative referendum.<br /><br />As a Labour member then, I campaigned for a Yes Yes vote alongside SNP, LD and Green supporters.<br /><br />The legislation wasn't introduced until 1998, because the detailed Bill wasn't presented to Parliament until the concept had been approved by referendum.<br /><br />Do try to get your facts right.<br /><br />oldnatnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1638916042737526171.post-91282163145199790672012-11-24T20:51:06.274+00:002012-11-24T20:51:06.274+00:00oldnat
the SNP opposed devolution and left the co...oldnat<br /><br />the SNP opposed devolution and left the constitutional convention. <br /><br />all the other parties, the churches and trades unions and other organisations laboured for 10 years to produce the devolution settlement. <br /><br />Labour came to power in 1997 and delevered the devolution bill, which the nats opposed.<br /><br />When it passed into law, they decided to campaign alongside Labour and others for a yes vote. <br /><br />So you're abt 5% right and 100% wrong..Bravehearthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07223196805548966030noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1638916042737526171.post-73677121220886795432012-11-24T20:02:02.058+00:002012-11-24T20:02:02.058+00:00s = miskeyed!s = miskeyed!Stravoniannoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1638916042737526171.post-88981331350154717682012-11-24T20:00:08.864+00:002012-11-24T20:00:08.864+00:00Allan
I stopped reading when you trotte4d out the...Allan<br /><br />I stopped reading when you trotte4d out the lie of spending £100,000 on the legal advice case.<br /><br />Sturgeon gave the answer in SP as roughly £4000 and counting.<br /><br />Seems to me to have been money well spent in order to keep the unionists off the scent of where the real legal advice had occurred.<br /><br />And if you don't know that by now you haven't been paying attention.snoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1638916042737526171.post-90911628540000406862012-11-24T19:19:02.957+00:002012-11-24T19:19:02.957+00:00Braveheart
You are really into errors today!
The...Braveheart<br /><br />You are really into errors today!<br /><br />The SNP strongly campaigned for the restoration of the Scottish Parliament - alongside Labour and LDs in 1997.<br /><br />You are confusing it with Gordon Wilson's (mistaken) decision to withdraw from the Constitutional Convention because it wasn't willing to include independence as an option.oldnatnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1638916042737526171.post-32699813335169328392012-11-24T19:07:03.498+00:002012-11-24T19:07:03.498+00:00Oldnat
Thanks for the correction. I thought it was...Oldnat<br />Thanks for the correction. I thought it was the Blessed Margot that said it...<br /><br />But the point stands, the Nats opposed devolution, don't think Holyrood is 100% legit and they certainly don't give it 100% respect.Bravehearthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07223196805548966030noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1638916042737526171.post-40973994256026335832012-11-24T18:56:15.793+00:002012-11-24T18:56:15.793+00:00Braveheart
Alas, your comment is as inaccurate as...Braveheart<br /><br />Alas, your comment is as inaccurate as the film! "Pretendy wee" was the dismissive description used by Unionist Billy Connolly.oldnatnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1638916042737526171.post-18293254889821154052012-11-24T18:40:46.646+00:002012-11-24T18:40:46.646+00:00Stuart you say "... I'm inclined to dis...Stuart you say "... I'm inclined to disagree with you, because the way I see it is that the SNP view Holyrood as a step towards independence... "<br /><br />I think we're in agreement...the SNP view Holyrood as a step towards independence, they don't respect it as a Parliament (wee pretendy, remember). <br /><br />They find it frustrating to be stuck in this system which they require to be flawed, therefore QED, the find that it <i>is</i> flawed, and not worthy of respect.<br /><br />It's not really legitimate in their eyes and it's stoppoing them getting where theywant to go, so they can treat it any way they like.<br /><br />And misleading the Parliament becomes less of a crime..."so what it's only a wee pretendy thing anyway." <br /><br />Allied to the fact that Eck's default position is arrogance anyway, and hey presto, he misleads the Parliament numerous times and, maybe even genuinely though I doubt it, can't see what he's done wrong.<br />Bravehearthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07223196805548966030noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1638916042737526171.post-16646571545579091242012-11-24T12:16:40.680+00:002012-11-24T12:16:40.680+00:00"For example - a lot of people still cite the...<i>"For example - a lot of people still cite the example of Johann Lamont talking about the fabricated rape case at FMQs as though Johann Lamont had fabricated it. Well she didn't. She was going by newspaper reports which turned out not to be true. So yes she said things which were untrue - but she did not intend to and therefore she shouldn't be accused of lying."</i><br /><br />The point being made, though - certainly by the FM on Thursday - wasn't that she was wrong, but that she entirely failed to then acknowledge the fact when the truth came to light. <br /><br />(Although you'd hope that a party leader would make some sort of effort at verifying stories, rather than just parroting whatever she sees in a newspaper.)<br /><br />She made no correction and no apology for a disgusting allegation based on a falsheood, and nor was she pulled up on it by a media which has now been banging on at enormous and vitriolic length about Salmond/Russell's error for the best part of a fortnight, even though both of them HAVE apologised and corrected their error.RevStuhttp://wingsland.podgamer.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1638916042737526171.post-32234313696167125682012-11-24T11:01:24.368+00:002012-11-24T11:01:24.368+00:00Peter.
I don't know if Newsnet (Scotland) cov...Peter.<br /><br />I don't know if Newsnet (Scotland) covered this, but the D-FM admitted (backed up by the FM) that they had not taken formal legal advice on I-Scotland's position on whether we would retain membership of the EU, or whether we would have to reapply - In essence they spent £100,000 of public money to keep out of the public domain legal advice that did not exist at that point. Own goal number one.<br /><br />Secondly, the Scottish Pound is part of the Sterling Zone because we are at the moment still in the same country as the English, the Welsh and the Northern Irish. The problem arises if we become a seperate independent country. The reason why readoption of Sterling is own goal number two is that there are suddenly issues that would arise with Independence, which would require a Maastricht style treaty to resolve. <br /><br />In any case I suspect that the SNP's preferred option (until very reciently) was entry to the Euro, hence the desire for Scotland to remain within the EU without consulting the Scottish People. It is the sense that the "Sterling Zone" scheme seems to be thought up on the hoof - given Swinney's unconvincing answers on this subject - that provides own goal number two.<br /><br />As I said earlier, were Lamont to be any good (and I think we have established that she is not a very good politician) the case for Independence would already be a dead duck in many people's eyes. That many of the coments above make the point that there is no strategy here only adds to the sense that the leader of the opposition is a very poor leader of the opposition.Allanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13574173214924437278noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1638916042737526171.post-66939945250822257902012-11-24T10:35:09.102+00:002012-11-24T10:35:09.102+00:00This comment has been removed by the author.Stewart Lochheadhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12837016687310695314noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1638916042737526171.post-44829026697441168772012-11-24T08:51:12.855+00:002012-11-24T08:51:12.855+00:00Mr Worrier
Can I suggest that you go back and loo...Mr Worrier<br /><br />Can I suggest that you go back and look at the last few relpies the First Minister has given to the LibDem leader, Willie Rennie's always polite and direct questions?<br /><br />Once you've done that I invite you to reconsider this piece.Grahamskihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00915154074403255676noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1638916042737526171.post-39593621280602816872012-11-24T07:56:36.126+00:002012-11-24T07:56:36.126+00:00Incidentally I think the issue about misleading pa...Incidentally I think the issue about misleading parliament cuts both ways. I have no doubt there are SNP researchers at this moment trawling through the Official Report looking for examples where oppositon MSPs have said things which were not accurate. I hope that - rather than publishing them - they simply send the results to the MSPs in question and say you might want to amend the Official Report to reflect that this was not accurate. That would make the point as effectively as publishing it.<br /><br />Or it could be done the way that Alex Salmond did it at FMQs with Ruth Davidson. But what you don't want to get into is a situation where people keep hurling accusations of being a liar at each other. That will just turn everyone off. <br /><br />For example - a lot of people still cite the example of Johann Lamont talking about the fabricated rape case at FMQs as though Johann Lamont had fabricated it. Well she didn't. She was going by newspaper reports which turned out not to be true. So yes she said things which were untrue - but she did not intend to and therefore she shouldn't be accused of lying. <br /><br />Ditto with going over the way people say things with a fine toothed comb. If someone is making a point they may well do so in a way that could be subject to different interpretations because that is just how debate happens and how people talk. If we get into a place where every sentence is analysed to the nth degree and every mistake is raked over again and again we will simply kill debate. That is surely not what anyone wants.Indyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04383904151475839441noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1638916042737526171.post-24671015264874461242012-11-24T07:30:35.123+00:002012-11-24T07:30:35.123+00:00I don't know if it is a strategy as such. The...I don't know if it is a strategy as such. There is a unionist strategy to try and bring down the Yes campaign by bringing down Alex Salmond and as many of his ministers as they think they can get. But a Samson strategy I am not so sure about. <br /><br />One thing is for sure though, the SNP needs to try and get out of this situation. Our people need to stop responding and rise above it, simple as that. The behaviour in the Scottish Parliament is getting to be atrocious. Tricia Marwick was quite right to suspend Michael McMahon and she ought to clamp down hard on any subsequent antics. It is embarrassing to watch sometimes.<br /><br />It is mainly the Labour people but there are too many SNP MSPs who respond in kind. That has to stop. I don't think you could overstate the public's disdain for that type of behaviour from people who are - after all - at their work! It's awful.<br /><br />On the issue of misleading parliament. Everyone has been guilty of this at some point or other. The question is whether it is intentional or not. When Alex Salmond says there are - I think - X number of jobs been created in X sector he is not lying if he gets the number wrong, he is just wrong because he is trying to remember rather than having the number on a bit of paper in front of him. To say that is lying or deliberately misleading parliament is just silly. People do things like that themselves all the time.<br /><br />In the case of college spending it was also not intentional - but the real underlying issue is that the Education Secretary appeared not to know whether spending was going up or down because he was going by a briefing where the author had not put in the additional spending from last year. That is genuinely concerning because it suggests a Cabinet Secretary who is overly reliant on briefings so if there is a mistake in the briefing he doesn't question it. <br /><br />Is that a resignation issue? In some circumstances it could be. I am rather glad Michael Russell has not resigned because I think he is doing a good job but I also hope he will make a point of double checking every figure he is given in future. <br /><br />But I think he would have been in much bigger trouble if Labour/Tories/Lib Dems had not adopted this get the SNP strategy. Because when everything is seen as evidence of incompetence/dishonesty/grounds for resignation then when someone does something which might actually be a bit incompetent it barely registers in amongst all the other froth and nonsense. Ironic.Indyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04383904151475839441noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1638916042737526171.post-42229972681782042562012-11-24T01:24:22.854+00:002012-11-24T01:24:22.854+00:00Braveheart, I'm inclined to disagree with you,...Braveheart, I'm inclined to disagree with you, because the way I see it is that the SNP view Holyrood as a step towards independence, and the only problem with it is that it's hamstrung by a lack of powers as things stand.<br /><br />So they've been trying to use it to demonstrate what could be achieved if only it had more powers. Which in turn is why the opposition parties are even more keen than normal to undermine the ruling administration. I think Mr Lallands' thesis is maybe a slight variation on conflating the SNP with Scotland and thus opposing the SNP amounts to opposing Scotland. So now attacking the SNP is attacking the seat of Scotland's democracy. Or something like that ;0)<br /><br />Anon @ 23.56. If it helps then I was trying to explain Labour's conduct rather than excuse it :0)Stuart Wintonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02772436419630464325noreply@blogger.com