tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1638916042737526171.post2068616785596330638..comments2024-03-28T07:16:39.621+00:00Comments on Lallands Peat Worrier: Why are the old, Unionist scare stories failing?Lallands Peat Worrierhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/18276270498204697708noreply@blogger.comBlogger46125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1638916042737526171.post-23333301042084317352011-12-13T14:00:48.682+00:002011-12-13T14:00:48.682+00:00In your own time, dear.In your own time, dear.RevStuhttp://wingsland.podgamer.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1638916042737526171.post-30710219091512354892011-12-13T11:04:36.314+00:002011-12-13T11:04:36.314+00:00See?
Intellectual torpor.See?<br /><br />Intellectual torpor.Bravehearthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07223196805548966030noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1638916042737526171.post-16209988834522109562011-12-13T10:08:22.700+00:002011-12-13T10:08:22.700+00:00Yawn. I'm ready when you are.Yawn. I'm ready when you are.RevStuhttp://wingsland.podgamer.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1638916042737526171.post-12519866653602242582011-12-13T09:57:17.145+00:002011-12-13T09:57:17.145+00:00Rev,
You see my problem? You are just the latest ...Rev,<br /><br />You see my problem? You are just the latest in a long line of nats who have failed to give any reason for their faith in "independence".<br /><br />Because, when you boil it down, that is what it is, faith: a quasi-religious belief with little real evidence to back it up... which is why you are struggling to provide what you call "cold hard facts and figures". <br /><br />Dont be upset Rev, it's not really your fault, that's just how faith works: if you believe, you don't need the facts, the <b>very fact that you believe is fact enough</b> (for you at least). And it leads to intellection torpor: if it's true (and it is true, have faith) then why bother gathering evidence to prove it is true?<br /><br />So it comes to pass that, in any such discussion, "you tell me first and I'll tell you" is nearly always the nationaliist last line of defence.....<br /><br />They never explain (because they cannot) why "independence" would be better. They only like to make the negative case against the current constitutional set up, so that any failing in the current regime (and all systems have failings) is seen as "proof" that we need "independence".<br /><br />For example, there is an economic crisis at the moment and the UK is suffering its share of the pain. "Look", cry excited nats "look at all that pain. We need "independence"", never considering if the pain would be just as bad or even worse if we had "independence".<br /><br />(And of course when there was a boom they cried "Look, Scotland's got the biggest banks in the world, proof, if proof were needed, that we need "independence"", never considering that bank failure would absolutely destroy the economy of an "independent" Scotland)<br /><br />In this way any explanation of why we wouldn't have the same failings if Scotland was "independent" is ignored or pooh-poohed, because it's a given fact of the faith, with no need of proof, that it would "better" if we were "independent".<br /><br />So, I could give you all the arguments there are in favour of not destroying the UK (which boil down to: it works ok, and there's no better alternative on offer, so why destroy it on speculation that things might get a wee bit better somehow, some way, some time, maybe never, who knows?) and you still wouldn't be persuaded to let go of your faith.<br /><br />Rev, I don't expect you to accept all of this. But I <b>most certainly do not</b> expect you to give a cogent argument with cold hard facts and figures to show why "independence" would be an improvement on the current constitutional set up...<br /><br />..because they don't exist, and if they did you would know them (which you obviously do not) and you would have posted them already...<br /><br />It would be great if you would at leasst attemp to prove me wrong...Bravehearthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07223196805548966030noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1638916042737526171.post-4097811923257590422011-12-13T01:16:57.601+00:002011-12-13T01:16:57.601+00:00Dying of old age before a Unionist ever answers th...Dying of old age before a Unionist ever answers that question.RevStuhttp://wingsland.podgamer.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1638916042737526171.post-10620580816984538872011-12-13T00:09:52.518+00:002011-12-13T00:09:52.518+00:00What are you afraid of?What are you afraid of?Bravehearthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07223196805548966030noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1638916042737526171.post-28222396763421845862011-12-12T23:16:10.621+00:002011-12-12T23:16:10.621+00:00Sure I can. As soon as we hear the positive case f...Sure I can. As soon as we hear the positive case for the Union.RevStuhttp://wingsland.podgamer.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1638916042737526171.post-66969063046468293222011-12-12T18:35:38.042+00:002011-12-12T18:35:38.042+00:00Can you point me to where I can see them?Can you point me to where I can see them?Bravehearthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07223196805548966030noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1638916042737526171.post-46486519969258863172011-12-12T17:52:33.651+00:002011-12-12T17:52:33.651+00:00We've put them in the public domain a thousand...We've put them in the public domain a thousand times. You just keep pretending to be deaf and blind.RevStuhttp://wingsland.podgamer.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1638916042737526171.post-3431925057816473682011-12-12T17:26:38.745+00:002011-12-12T17:26:38.745+00:00Rev
It's not about persuading the public. I do...Rev<br />It's not about persuading the public. I doubt if there's anyone left on this thread but me and you.<br /><br />It's about your (and cybernats generally) ignorance of the basic arguments that underpin your political beliefs.<br /><br />Either that or your acknowledgement that your arguments are too weak to put in the public domain for fear of derision.<br /><br />Either way.....Bravehearthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07223196805548966030noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1638916042737526171.post-13786169006679012202011-12-12T16:54:07.238+00:002011-12-12T16:54:07.238+00:00Yawn.
Keep it up, love. It's really winning t...Yawn.<br /><br />Keep it up, love. It's really winning the Scottish electorate over.RevStuhttp://wingsland.podgamer.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1638916042737526171.post-39576931766518117342011-12-12T13:30:19.037+00:002011-12-12T13:30:19.037+00:00@RevStu
Actually, if you go back through this thr...@RevStu<br /><br />Actually, if you go back through this thread you'll see that I asked for LPW to make the case for "independence". And you butted in. <br /><br />So <b>I'm</b> waiting for <b>you</b>..<br /><br />In fact I'm not really, because you haven't a clue how to answer the very basic questions I posed.I know it, you know it, anyone reading this thread knows it.<br /><br />Sad really.<br /><br />"What do we want?"<br /><br />"INDEPENDECE"!!!<br /><br />"Why do we want it?"<br /><br />"Haven't a clue.....sorry...". <br /><br />wanders off... baffled..<br /><br />"Here Eck? Why do we want it?".<br /><br />"Don't listen to them Rev. Them unionists.. always looking for us to have the facts.... WE KNOW we're right, why do we have to explain?"<br /><br />"But Eeck, <b>I don't</b> have the facts..."<br /><br />"Never mind. Trust me. I'm a politician. I've got them somewhere.... <br /><br />..have you seen my whirling bow tie?"Bravehearthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07223196805548966030noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1638916042737526171.post-28297276941405503132011-12-12T13:01:56.474+00:002011-12-12T13:01:56.474+00:00"Take your time"
I'll take as long ...<i>"Take your time"</i><br /><br />I'll take as long as it takes for you to post an ACTUAL positive case for the Union, rather than a glib soundbite, then you'll get all the answers you ever wanted.RevStuhttp://wingsland.podgamer.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1638916042737526171.post-23458918600005095842011-12-12T11:49:01.221+00:002011-12-12T11:49:01.221+00:00BTW,
anyone can answer the above questions, I'...BTW,<br /><br />anyone can answer the above questions, I'm not limiting to RevStu....just in case you thought I was...Bravehearthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07223196805548966030noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1638916042737526171.post-19765321850411692032011-12-12T08:57:38.418+00:002011-12-12T08:57:38.418+00:00Ahhhhh RevStu "And there certainly IS a bette...Ahhhhh RevStu "And there certainly IS a better alternative on offer, as anyone who's spent even a day in Norway"<br /><br />So your alternative is that the UK should emulate Norway?<br /><br />I know that's not what you mean, only joking. But, TBH Rev, you're not making your case very clear.<br /><br />So here are a few questions and clarifications to help direct your thoughts:<br /><br />Do you believe that Scotland would be economically better off if we left the UK?<br /><br />If so, why do you think that? As you say, backed up by cold hard facts and figures would be nice.<br /><br />And if you think the people of Scotland would be better off economically, by how much would they be better off?<br /><br />How long would it take to achieve this "better off"? Would it come the day after "independence"? Or would we have to wait a year, a decade, 70 years (like Ireland only to lose it again) 100 years (like Norway) Never (like many African states)? Some reason, facts and arguments would be useful here as well, if you have them.<br /><br />Would the amount that you think we might be "better off" be worth all the legal complications, constitutional upheaval, economic costs, political energy and personal bother and general all-round hassle of achieving it?<br /><br />Take your time, these are not easy questions to answer. I know, because I've asked them before and got quite a lot of rot in reply....<br /><br />And, BTW, that's only the start...Bravehearthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07223196805548966030noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1638916042737526171.post-36738402465951011872011-12-11T22:09:36.877+00:002011-12-11T22:09:36.877+00:00"The case for not destroying the UK is simple...<i>"The case for not destroying the UK is simple: it's not perfect but it has worked for 300 years and it gives no indication of not working now. And, crucially, there's no better alternative on offer."</i><br /><br />That's not a case, that's an assertion of personal opinion backed up by nothing. The UK is not "working", it's bankrupt. And there certainly IS a better alternative on offer, as anyone who's spent even a day in Norway (or read any of the UN's quality-of-life rankings tables) could tell you, backed up by cold hard facts and figures. <br /><br />But since you're clearly only interested in trolling rather than a reasoned, grown-up debate, I'll leave you to it. After all, the SNP are at 51% in the polls to Labour's 26%, and as Napoleon once said, <i>"Never interrupt your enemy when he's making a mistake."</i>RevStuhttp://wingsland.podgamer.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1638916042737526171.post-44400129059326210322011-12-11T15:26:51.882+00:002011-12-11T15:26:51.882+00:00RevStu, the case that I made was..
"The case...RevStu, the case that I made was..<br /><br />"The case for not destroying the UK is simple: it's not perfect but it has worked for 300 years and it gives no indication of not working now. And, crucially, there's no better alternative on offer."<br /><br />and then "if it ain't broke don't fix it".<br /><br />You haven't addressed the bit about the alternative which I believe you call "independence". As a Nationalist I had thought you might have some thoughts on that.<br /><br />Apparently not.<br /><br />Not really surprised though.Bravehearthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07223196805548966030noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1638916042737526171.post-59907465437676388942011-12-11T14:58:46.681+00:002011-12-11T14:58:46.681+00:00Am Firinn said..."Ah, but the Union manifestl...Am Firinn said..."Ah, but the Union manifestly isn't working now. Scotland has turned in a surplus this last five years."<br /><br />So. Scotland running a surplus is a sign that the UK isn't working..???!!!!<br /><br />And if Scotland was running a deficit that would be a sign that the UK was being successful?<br /><br />Really?Bravehearthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07223196805548966030noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1638916042737526171.post-28299546210682711032011-12-11T14:34:20.165+00:002011-12-11T14:34:20.165+00:00"If it ain't broke don't fix it."...<i>"If it ain't broke don't fix it."</i><br /><br />Sorry, I'd momentarily imagined you were actually going to make some sort of reasoned, positive case there. My fault for engaging with trolls.<br /><br />If that pathetic effort is your argument, mine is "independence would be much nicer because the weather would be better". It's no less spurious or idiotic than yours. Congratulations on your constructive contribution to the debate.RevStuhttp://wingsland.podgamer.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1638916042737526171.post-46669479941508865862011-12-11T14:07:43.409+00:002011-12-11T14:07:43.409+00:00If it ain't broke don't fix it.
Makes sen...If it ain't broke don't fix it.<br /><br />Makes sense to me.<br /><br />Now what's your positive case for the alternative that you mistakenly call "independence"?Bravehearthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07223196805548966030noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1638916042737526171.post-69028103736624694002011-12-11T14:06:16.367+00:002011-12-11T14:06:16.367+00:00Ah, but the Union manifestly isn't working now...Ah, but the Union manifestly isn't working now. Scotland has turned in a surplus this last five years. This may or may not be a permanent position: certainly the breast-clingers tell us Scotland would run at a £4bn or a £9bn deficit, depending on which figure they have plucked (necessarily, for this is all conjecture) out of thin air. Now, remind me what the UK's deficit is again? As I say, I really can't imagine how anyone thinks the Union game is worth the candle...Am Firinnnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1638916042737526171.post-8998415928909671182011-12-11T13:35:33.701+00:002011-12-11T13:35:33.701+00:00"The case for not destroying the UK is simple..."The case for not destroying the UK is simple: it's not perfect but iit has worked for 300 years and it gives no indication of not working now. And, crucially, there's no better alternative on offer."<br /><br />That's your "positive case for the Union" then, is it? That's what you're going with?RevStuhttp://wingsland.podgamer.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1638916042737526171.post-44533250970223204772011-12-11T13:32:17.699+00:002011-12-11T13:32:17.699+00:00Oh dear!
Who's trolling now reverand?
Anyway...Oh dear!<br /><br />Who's trolling now reverand?<br /><br />Anyways.<br /><br />The case for not destroying the UK is simple: it's not perfect but iit has worked for 300 years and it gives no indication of not working now.<br /><br /><br />And, crucially, there's no better alternative on offer.<br /><br />That's what I asked you to describe, and that's what I have 100% confidence you won't even attempt....<br /><br />btw, did you see lpw on telly just now...<br /><br />scruffy bugger, needs a haircut... but knows his onions on the batty secterianism bill.Bravehearthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07223196805548966030noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1638916042737526171.post-63268491836073115082011-12-11T12:40:38.581+00:002011-12-11T12:40:38.581+00:00Sorry, there seems to have been some sort of techn...Sorry, there seems to have been some sort of technical glitch. The positive case for the Union appears to have accidentally fallen out of your post. Please resend.RevStuhttp://wingsland.podgamer.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1638916042737526171.post-74887373060734241592011-12-11T10:48:21.038+00:002011-12-11T10:48:21.038+00:00So your case is that, give us 100% of NS oil reven...So your case is that, give us 100% of NS oil revenues and everything else will be wonderful?<br /><br />Hardly heavyweight analysis, is it?Bravehearthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07223196805548966030noreply@blogger.com